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It's not quite like that. Pagan, unlike many religions, does not have a set belief system or god(s) to worship. Pagans are free to choose how they pracice their religion as long as they maintain the basic Pagan principles. In this way you can have some Pagans that worship a number of gods and godesses and some that don't worship any, but perhaps worship nature.

Correct me if I'm wrong Liv.

But Magnus' point is good a lot of people say they're pagan just to seem hip and cool. Strange as it is.

Actually what he said was that many of Liv's Pagan friends are only saying the're Pagan to seem cooler.

While I'm sure there are some people who say they are Pagan but don't actually understand the religion, it is unfair to say that Liv's friends fit into this category when it is him that doesn't understand the Pagan religion.

Oh right. Well i'm sure Murdoch will apologise.

I do hope that was your ever-beloved artful dry humor, my dear....

I know it's probably bad form to judge someone by their internet sig ... but anyone who associates themself with the phrase "I'm in the business of misery" ... is quite possibly a scene-point countin' emo kid...

Hmm I wouldn't say that Pete, She's not very emo. as far as i could tell when she was detached from Tam's face.

in other words, I couldn't see at all because they were snogging the entire time LOL.

She is not a scene kid, I assure you, and I would like you to take it back because from what I've read from you today it seems somewhat to me like you've taken a disliking to me and are now taking that as far as insulting my girlfriend and her friends.

If you hadn't noticed, Liv hasn't even said anything here for ages, and her taster in music and what she puts in her sig is not really any of your business and it is a very narrow way to judge someone. I'd be curious to know what incredibly perceptive idea you get of me based on my sig, except that I'm fairly sure now it wouldn't be positive and I don't actually care what you think about me.

I think you need to face the fact that you don't actually know what you are talking about here, I think Liv knows more about her religion than you do.

And on that note, this has moved well away from the original topic of literary discussion so I think we should move it back to what it's supposed to be.

My opinions on paganism have nothing to do with any feelings I have towards you or your girlfriend, I assure. I'm not petty enough to take an active dislike to anyone I meet on the sodding internet. All I said is that from my perspective of what I can read from how she chooses to represent herself at this particular moment on this particular forum, via sig, dp, etc, it looks like she might be a scene kid. If she's the furthest thing from a scene kid that ever existed and just has an unfortunate tendency to put quotes from bad emo-bands or some obscure tween pop-lit in her sig, then I'm sorry for what might have been interpreted as a slight on her personality, but I don't retract anything I said about the current trends in teenage paganism.

well for the record we are both 18, hardly 'tween'.

As for what you say about teenage pagansim, that was never what I had a problem with, it was only how you applied it to Liv and her friends.

All I have a problem with is you passing jugement on someone based on a few comments on a forum, espeacially when most people here know her far better than you.

Hi. This appears to be getting quite ridiculous.

I don't really care if you call me an emo or a scene kid or whatever it is you're going on about.

Does it matter? Can't someone be themselves without putting a label on it?

You have no idea what my DP refers to. Does having a hard childhood make you emo? What's wrong with being emo? What's wrong with showing your feelings?

Emo is just another label. No, I don't dress in black or die my hair black. I listen to gothic/emotronic music such as Corinna Fugate, Evanescence and Paramore. So what?

If listening to that music and being myself makes me emo, then I'm proud to be called emo.

I was just giving an opinion, Timtam took to the offensive, so I sharpened my claws, automated response. You're right, someone should be themselves without having to have a label, and if you understand that then I've misjudged you. Everyone's got a right to their own tastes in whatever (even if it does include evanescence...)

Clarification of this whole debarcle:

1) Liv isn't emo, she's happy and awesome
2) SOME kids say they are pagan to seem alternative. This may or may not apply to livs friends but I don't know them and therefore don't care
3) Paul said Paramore was tweeny, not you guys.
4) But Paramore is more punk/atern rock anyway.
5) I just made 4 points on little niggles I have with this argument
6) Shit, now it's five
7) I'm going to stop counting these points now, from now on i'll just count Stanley's. so that's ONE, woof.
8 - Thank you all for adding some bitch fuel to The nutshell's ever overflowing tank, we're in no danger of running out, so please amp down
9) I can ride my bike with no handlebars
10) We all love you a big huggy bunch. now settle down and live happily, for we are one small sanctuary for our kind and we must stick together if we are to survive. Unfortunately our repopulation scheme isn't working due to everyone catching the gay.

artsgeek wrote:

So basically, many of your pagan friends are aligning themselves to a religion with which they (like most) have very little understanding of in order to gain more emo-kid scene points?

No.... not even close.

One of them is about to start studying Pharmacy at Otago University and is likely to be in the top 7 or 8 students in his entire school.

Another is one year into a Medical Research degree at Auckland University and last year sat and received scholarships in Classics and the sciences.

A third is 22 and on his OE in England for the year, I've heard he's doing quite well over there...

A fourth is Year 11 at Westlake Girl's and a lot of the people on this forum knows her and would tell you, she's not emo or scene at all...

The fifth spent last year working full time for an insurance company and is now doing a course in looking after horses or something along those lines... can't really remember what it was...

But hey, insult them all you want. They're all incredibly intelligent, highly motivated and hard working young people, ranging from age 15 up to 24. If you called any of them emo or scene, they'd pummel you. They know a whole lot more about this religion that you do, that's for sure! Paganism about nature and the worship of nature. From that comes a whole branch of different types of Pagans. Wiccans, druids, etc. The ancient Greeks were Pagan and yes, they had lots of deities but some people don't. One of my friends believes in "Mother Earth" but not in a personified way.

You don't want to start this fight, because you're going to lose. These people have been studying this since they were small, as have I, and I can tell you, they're not doing this for "points". They've been studying this for years and years and years, and they're a whole lot more skilled at it than anyone I've ever met.

Wtf is a scene kid?

artsgeek wrote:

I was just giving an opinion, Timtam took to the offensive, so I sharpened my claws, automated response. You're right, someone should be themselves without having to have a label, and if you understand that then I've misjudged you. Everyone's got a right to their own tastes in whatever (even if it does include evanescence...)

Yup, they do. I also listen to Hilary Duff, Sweeny Todd soundtrack, Rent soundtrack (actually, any soundtracks from musicals)....Avril Lavigne, Disney, Cascada, Emilie Autumn, Les Miserables, Hairspray, Panic at the Disco, Pink, Sandi Thom, The Sound of Music... and the list goes on. I'm not sure you can classify someone who listens to Les Mis, Disney, Cascada and Sandi Thom to be emo but hey, if so, go right ahead... doesn't make a difference to me what you call me. I'm me, I'm not emo or punk or goth or popular or scene or jock or whatever other category you can pick to label me into. I'm the lesbian who's got long brown hair halfway down her back, wears high heels, dresses in skirts and dresses a lot of the time and who is short and skinny. I love to dance (ballet and jazz), I play in a hockey team and I've played soccer and tennis before, I've taken a painting class, been on an exchange to Bolivia, I love making films, I am obsessed with History and I'm on a gap year and next year I'm going to study Law, History, Psychology and International Relations at Auckland Uni. I want to be a teacher or psychologist. Yup, that's me. Pick me apart all you want but I am who I am and your opinion isn't needed! (to borrow a quote).

I don't fit into any stereotypes and I'm sure you wouldn't want to be slotted into a label either, so don't do it to other people.

Logiebear wrote:

Unfortunately our repopulation scheme isn't working due to everyone catching the gay.

They'll find a cure soon enough, for most a temporary solution can be found in consuming a large quantity of alcohol in a short period of time. WARNING This should not be used for long term treatment. Results may not be seen in all patients. Accidental treatment of people without the gay may result in the temporary catching of the gay.

Logiebear wrote:

Unfortunately our repopulation scheme isn't working due to everyone catching the gay.

...McCain should SO use this as a tagline to explain why the Bush Administration is down the shitter.

wretchedkisses wrote:

Logiebear wrote:

Unfortunately our repopulation scheme isn't working due to everyone catching the gay.

...McCain should SO use this as a tagline to explain why the Bush Administration is down the shitter.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I tried your treatment Logan, but I don't think it works, in fact, I believe it made my condition worse...

Hmm interesting. I prescribe hourly screenings of 2 girls 1 cup. That should do the trick.

Do I want to know?

No. You really REALLY don't.

Would that be the one with the vomit-play?

Yes indeed